Monday, November 10, 2008

Study of the LDS Church - 3.3 The Doctrine of Man

**Make sure you've read this post first!

Who are we? Where did we come from? The LDS church answers those questions in the follow way:

God became a god by following all of the tenets of true faith and earning his right to become God. He was given the room to create a universe. He and his wives (who had progressed with him) would sexually procreate children in a spirit form. The first born was Jesus. The rest of us soon followed. We are all, then, literal sons and daughters of God.

There were decisions to be made and allegiances to be had in pre-mortal existence. As we will talk about next time, the rebellious along with Lucifer were cast out of God’s presence. So the fact that we were born on earth indicates that we took God’s side in the War of Heaven. The more obedient you were, the more likely you were to be born into a Jewish tribe or into a faithful Mormon family.

Jeremiah 1:5: Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. Mormons teach that this is clear indication of a pre-mortal existence.
John 17:5: And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. This too indicates to the LDS faithful that pre-existence must be true for all of God’s spirit children—since Jesus (the one saying this) was our spirit-brother, we all would then have the same characteristics.
Acts 17:28-29: For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring. Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device. Offspring = children by birth through the Heavenly Father and Mother per the LDS church.
Romans 8:16-17: The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. We are children of God in the most literal sense according to the teachings of the LDS church leaders.

So there is much evidence in the Bible to support pre-existence, is there not? Well let’s see…

To refute the above scripture, we only have to go to that scripture itself, although I will give you additional scripture to further back up the Christian argument.

Jeremiah 1:5: (above) This scripture seen above does not refer to a knowing personally. You see, when your God is an all-knowing God, He seems to know what is to happen before it does. This is not an indication that Jeremiah existed before conception on earth, but only that God knew that Jeremiah would be a prophet before he was formed in his mother’s belly. The Hebrew word (yada) used for “know” here implies a relationship of commitment and ordination It says nothing of Jeremiah pre-existing, but rather being known beforehand to be a prophet on the way.
Genesis 2:7: And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. Notice that a pre-existing soul did not enter a body, but the body and soul came into being at the same time.
1 Corinthians 15:46: Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. Doesn’t Paul clearly note here that the physical body comes before the spirit-filled body?
John 17:5: (above) I will not argue with an LDS member that Jesus, in fact, did pre-exist. However, since he is the same as God the Father (as shown during the Doctrine of Jesus portion), it would make sense that he would say this. However, he is the only man who has ever been pre-mortal. Doesn’t Jesus clearly separate himself from mankind in John 8:23-24?
Acts 17:28-29 (above): Please step your LDS acquaintance back to verse 26, which states, “And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;” Doesn’t this indicate that God is our Father because he created us an not because of an earthly definition of a father. Malachi 2:10 wraps up this idea into one verse when it says, “Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us?...”
Romans 8:16-17 (above) is an easy one to clarify. Back up one verse. Doesn’t verse 15 state, “For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.” Right there—we are adopted into the family of God not birthed naturally. You can also see this in Galatians 4:5-6 and Ephesians 1:5.

So suffice it to say that the Bible is clear on the fact that we were not pre-mortal spirits, but that God merely knew of us because He is all-knowing. Although Jesus did pre-exist, it was as (the Word of) God and not as a spirit child conceived by spirit parents. And we also were not naturally God’s child (in a biological sense), but have been adopted into His family by our faith in Christ.

Due to the drastic flopping from one argument—arguments that are so far separated that there is no similarities contained—to another in the last few days, I’m sure that regardless which side of the argument you are on, your brain is about fried. I will not, then, offer more commentary to further stretch your limits.

  1. There’s a difference between and adopted child and a natural child, right? Then how do you explain the LDS teaching that we are God’s spirit-born children against the following Bible verses: Romans 8:15, Galatians 4:5-6; and Ephesians 1:5?
  2. Is there anywhere in Biblical teaching that implies that a Heavenly Mother exists or even is necessary?
  3. Did you know that Hippocrates is known as the “father of medicine;” H.G. Wells and Jules Verne are each known as the “father of science fiction;” and Archimedes was the “father of mathematics”? Doesn’t this indicate that they created the processes and studies and did not physically conceive (with a woman) these ideas? Doesn’t this demonstrate how “father” can be used as a title of the creator or originator?

Study of the LDS Church - 3.4 The Doctrine of Satan

No comments: